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What would it take for Russia to be #1?


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#4081 woj1@cyberonic.

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Posted 06 October 2004 - 01:10 PM

Originally posted by Bader
Its a matter of trust. Bush will be where ever he feels doG wants him to be. Profits are never accepted in their own society.



Some are getting confusion which Dog is in charge;
for example Polish president recently changed the rout ; Washington is out , flies to Moscow , Paris is in. He might forever stay in sky. :)
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#4082 woj1@cyberonic.

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Posted 06 October 2004 - 05:37 PM

US vetoed UN resolution regarding removing Istrael from Palestynian land.
Why Kerry or Edwards wasn't question ed about his politics regarding Israel?
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#4083 donquijote

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Posted 07 October 2004 - 03:02 AM

I guess the lion has no humor for the funny monkey and wants him out of the way. What a pity the monkey only wants to perpetuate the jungle...:(

Maybe the joke was bad. Wouldn't it have been better if he asked for people to throw away all underwear? It would have been a better show than puppet election show.;)

10/6/04

Friends,

You may have heard by now that the Michigan Republican Party has called for my arrest. That's right. They literally want me brought up on charges -- and hope that I'm locked up.

No, I'm not kidding. The Republican Party, yesterday, filed a criminal complaint with the prosecutors in each of the counties where I spoke last week in Michigan.

My crime? Clean underwear for anyone who will vote in the upcoming election.

Each night on our 60-city "Slacker Uprising Tour" through the 20 battleground states, I've been registering hundreds (and on some nights, thousands) of voters at my arena and stadium events. I then ask for everyone over 23 who has never voted (or didn't vote in the last election) to stand up. I tell these slackers that I understand and respect why they think politicians are not worth the bother. I tell them that I may have been the original slacker, and that I do not want them to change their slacker ways. Keep sleeping 'til noon! Keep drinking beer! Stay on the sofa and watch as much TV as possible! But, please, just for me, on 11/2, I want you to leave the house and give voting a try -- just this once. The stakes this time are just too high.

If they promise me that they'll do this, I give the guys a 3-pack of new Fruit of the Loom underwear, and the women get a day's supply of Ramen noodles, the sustenance of slackers everywhere.

I then close by having them repeat the 2004 Slacker Oath: "Pick nose! Pick butt! Pick Kerry."

It seems to have worked, as each night the volunteer tables are swamped afterwards with hundreds of new and young voters signing up to campaign for regime change for the next four weeks.

The satire of all this seems to have been lost on the Republicans. Or maybe it hasn't. The state of Michigan (where we spent most of last week) reported that over 100,000 young people recently registered to vote, a record that no one saw coming. The Slacker Tour has turned into a huge steamroller with a momentum all its own.

So, the Republican Party, to show their gratitude that so many young people will now be involved in our system, has demanded that I be sent to jail for trying to "bribe" students to vote.

Of course, this would be quite laughable if they weren't so serious about their charges. But they are. I may soon be a wanted man in Michigan -- simply because I convinced a few slackers to change their underwear and eat a healthy meal of artificially flavored noodles.

I thought I'd seen it all this year -- Disney refusing to distribute the film they paid for, right-wingers harassing theater owners who showed "Fahrenheit 9/11," conservative action groups trying to get the FEC to kick our film ads off the air, the unnecessary restrictive R-rating that forced teenagers to sneak in to see it, and all the stupid, crazy attacks on me and my movie that I've had to listen to as I watched the public ignore them and pack the movie houses anyway, where my film was being shown. And when all that failed, five different Republican groups made five different attack dog tapes (oops, "documentaries"!) against me in a period of about six weeks. But they were all so bad, so boring, so right-wing, no one wanted to watch them and they too went away, a sad waste of good videotape.

Now, after enduring all this, with no tricks left in their bag, they've just decided, "Let's toss his sorry *** behind bars -- him and his noodles and his gift of clean underwear!"

My friends, they will not catch me. Though I may be on the run, and I may never be able to return home to my beloved Michigan, I make this solemn vow to you and yours: The slackers of America shall not be denied their noodles, they will proudly wear their clean underwear as free Americans, and they will vote Bush out of office come November 2nd (though they will not show up to the polls until well after noon)!

Stay strong, stay slacker, and please remember to turn the underwear inside out every three days. As for the noodles, add boiling water, stir.

Yours,

Michael Moore
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#4084 Bader

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Posted 07 October 2004 - 06:53 AM

If someone was to go on the road and get people mad at the system to vote for anyone except the two dogs Mut and Putt,
sometimes referred to as tweddlie-dum, and tweedlie-dee, like Moore is doing, but for a good cause instead of an underwear and noodles party to get Bush AWOL from the Whitehouse.

Arabs not bothering to get rid of invaders? Whats the Middle East war all about? Perhaps Michael Moore will move on to there to solve all their problems with his unintended humour.

Who's moving the Settlers out of Arab land? The Wall, is this the new Arab Kibutz, a gift from the good-neighbour?

"After loss in Afghanistan, next try..."

I came across a comment that actually questioned whether the US implant leader controlled Kabul, forget the rest of the country.
The US havent lost there, only the Afghanies. The opium crop is brobably the biggest to date and the instability/lack of a
stable, sovereign regime means the scattering of US military bases are sounder than NY.

Where next? Ask Sharon, he is about to recieve 5000 heavy precision guided bombs that can takeout the Iranian nuclear site
and key military targets underground in Iran , Syria, Saudi Arabia
and Egypt. JUst think what a marvolous Wish-list opportunity
Michael Moore has given these guys in return for certain favours on voting day for a desperate man.

"Attack on Russia already on horizon".

Which Horizon is Beslan on Woj?

The US military gift to Israel this year is 2.16 billion, contemporary
alleged news with the heavy precision bombs is that the Iranian leader has asked for few nuclear warheads be produced by early next year. Why the hurry? Well partly the threat of a "pre-emptive" strike (the spin for surprise war) but that can also attract a strike, but there is already a state of urgency in Israel
pushing the Wall and moving settlers to safety well ahead of the original time planned.
Price of oil has gone up inspite of increased production which may be because of stockpilling which is a common sign of preparation for a major war.

Is there a jewdicial enquiry into who the Popes real mother was?
What about his wife, it has been said he was married at one time.
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#4085 Bader

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Posted 07 October 2004 - 08:57 AM

Here's a section form an article on Israel Shamirs site for Woj and DonQ.

While Ben Gurion sympathised with Marxism and later on with Social Democracy, Jabotinsky sympathised with Fascism. He admired Mussolini who supported him. Jabotinsky died in 1940 before the proclamation of The State Of Israel. He founded the Jewish terror organisation Irgun which committed its most horrible deeds during the expulsion of the Palestinians. The Lehi, a splinter group headed by Stern, murdered Folke Bernadotte who was the UN representative and mediator. The man who pulled the trigger became Ben Gurion's good friend and security guard when he retired to the kibbutz Sde Bocker. The leaders of both organisations Menachem Begin and Yitzhak Shamir later became Prime Ministers of Israel.

It is remarkable how similar the two Zionist standpoints are in practical politics. The Iron-Wall policy is now being completed by Israel's present Prime Minister, Ariel Sharon, with greater military force than ever before. Sharon belongs to the same right-wing group as Begin and Shamir (Likud). However it was the governments lead by the Social Democrats that started and completed most of the considerable expansion of Jewish settlements on the West Bank and Gaza. The Eastern European Jews, who were Marxists, stamped their mark on the colonisation of Palestine during the first half of the twentieth century. Collective farms - the kibbutz - were the main instrument in bringing it about. They were democratic, socialist, experimental units, often secular. No money was in use and the collective upbringing of children was common for a long time. Only Jews were allowed to be members. The seemingly racist kibbutz played an important part in the capture and military defence of occupied territory. The settlements of today on the West Bank and in Gaza serve a similar purpose, though they are religiously orthodox.

A Zionist leftist ideology dominated in the beginning. As shown above this can also be seen as Jewish National Socialism, upheld by Ben Gurion. After the occupation of the West Bank and Gaza in 1967 a Zionist right-wing ideology, like Jabotinsky`s has dominated. The Israeli "left" of today is predominately left-wing Zionism. Within Zionism's two main standpoints there has been interaction. Thus left-wing Zionism has targeted policies for the settlements, while the right-wing has been responsible for terrorism and ethnic cleansing. After 1967, the religious influence on Israel's politics has grown. However, religion has always been important in Zionism. Nowadays in Israel, religion and politics have merged.
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#4086 woj1@cyberonic.

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Posted 07 October 2004 - 01:08 PM

Originally posted by Bader
Price of oil has gone up inspite of increased production which may be because of stockpilling which is a common sign of preparation for a major war.

Is there a jewdicial enquiry into who the Popes real mother was?
What about his wife, it has been said he was married at one time.



Monsieur Abbe -
Franz Liszt Hungarian composer was about to marry Russian married princess with consent her husband who was promised her Ukrainian property.
Romance was destroyed by Russian tsar who refused to divorce nobilities and Liszt had to leave Russia.
After a Paris success in 1823, he toured Europe, but his new a love affair led to a desire to give up music for the priesthood. :)
An affair with Countess Marie d'Agoult resulted in the birth of his daughter, Cosima (1837
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#4087 woj1@cyberonic.

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Posted 07 October 2004 - 01:58 PM

Originally posted by Bader
Here's a section form an article on Israel Shamirs site for Woj and DonQ.

The Eastern European Jews, who were Marxists, stamped their mark on the colonisation of Palestine during the first half of the twentieth century. Collective farms - the kibbutz - were the main instrument in bringing it about. They were democratic, socialist, experimental units, often secular. No money was in use and the collective upbringing of children was common for a long time. Only Jews were allowed to be members. The seemingly racist kibbutz played an important part in the capture and military defence of occupied territory. Nowadays in Israel, religion and politics have merged.



Not Marx only Christ was the first Jew socialist .

The collective upbringing of children was Greece Plato idea described in Plato the
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#4088 donquijote

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Posted 08 October 2004 - 03:15 AM

http://engforum.prav...lts&pollid=1846
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#4089 Bader

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Posted 08 October 2004 - 06:33 AM

President Bush Snr dropped the words (of mess distraction)
"a thousand points of light", obviously a masonic type sign to the enlightened ones around the world regards at what stage things are passing into, so this sounds like "your thousand and up one".

"only Christ was the first socialist"

oh good Woj, that lets the early church off the hook! And what about the Last Supper, dont tell us its the first Business Round Table. Cecil Rhodes wasnt the first either.
Anyway Christianity must be banned because it s a WMD.
Yes, drinking from the same cup can be fatal in todays world, so worship of mass destruction must be banned.

Marx wrote whole book on socio-political orgnisation/philosophy.
Give us one verse from the records of Jesus Woj to support your
claim.
Howcome Christianity was persecuted by Communist Russia and the satellite countries, if Jesus was the first communist and a significant influence around the world?
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#4090 Bader

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Posted 08 October 2004 - 10:05 AM

Here's Lenins goal of world centralised democracy, from the Commonwealth Club website



Schell: What is the right balance of sovereignty and internationalism
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#4091 Bader

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Posted 08 October 2004 - 10:20 AM

He isnt against the Bush admin and there is a hint of support, it seems that replacing him isnt the issue.
The essential issue is that National sovereignty must be made subject to a world authority. A world authority would provide legitimacy, integrity to any use of force, which was lacking in the Bush invasion, not bad in itself.
Smell the global lion?

The bankers behind the Fed own the US and its foreign policy and so if this expensive mess based on lies wasnt in their interest it wouoldnt have happened. Thats where the legitmacy comes and goes from. Its a natural part of business and banking, not to mention the effect on futures and options and the welfare of huge enterises whom owe huge debts to the bankers.
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#4092 woj1@cyberonic.

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Posted 08 October 2004 - 11:46 AM

Originally posted by Bader
I was given a copy of an article by a Austrian scientist who argued the same line as Joe Vialls, that oil is being produced by natural forces/science within the bowls of the earth, which means
there is yet another hoax let loose on society.
It came from the Nexus site:

www.nexusmagazine.com


August-Sept issue. Article called "The Mysterious Origins of Oil"

by Siegfried E. Tischler, PhD.

He calls the current theory of oil formation "little more than an apodictic religious dogma".
.



I can not be the member of. nexusmagazine.
Could you be so kind and open a few secrets of this theory?



A World authority and Heaven authority de facto have the same purpose; the world authority.

Competition for world authority set communists against church, but in Poland church cooperated with communists. Arc. Glemp served in communism then and in capitalism now.
Today whole Vatican cooperates with world authority which is now on the top. Christ was interested in God Kingdom, but it didn
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#4093 woj1@cyberonic.

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Posted 08 October 2004 - 12:47 PM

Originally posted by donquijote

My crime? Clean underwear for anyone who will vote in the upcoming election.


I then close by having them repeat the 2004 Slacker Oath: "Pick nose! Pick butt! Pick Kerry."

The slackers of America shall not be denied their noodles, they will proudly wear their clean underwear as free Americans, and they will vote Bush out of office come November 2nd (though they will not show up to the polls until well after noon)!

Stay strong, stay slacker, and please remember to turn the underwear inside out every three days.
Yours,

Michael Moore




HAVING OPTIONS IS THE NAME OF THE GAME.
Just as long one doesn
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#4094 woj1@cyberonic.

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Posted 09 October 2004 - 10:08 AM

Russian Federal Security Service (FSB) Director Nikolai Patrushev attended in Minsk, a ceremony on 7 October to unveil a memorial complex dedicated to Soviet secret-police founder Feliks Dzerzhinskii. The memorial, at the Dzerzhinskii family's estate of Dzyarzhynava, was reportedly funded by the CIS council that unites members' security chiefs. Belarusian President Alyaksandr Lukashenka told the audience at the ceremony that the CIS special services are not enjoying "the best of times, just as when the powerful organization of chekists was created" in 1917. http://www.rferl.org...sline/1-rus.asp

Polish are never properly appreciated
Creator of NKVD was Polish, Feliks Dzierzynski . Dzerzhinsky was son of a Polish nobleman, at first he was student in seminary , next Bolshevik leader, head of NKVD the first Soviet secret police organization, a forerunner of the KGB. :)
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#4095 Bader

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Posted 09 October 2004 - 11:15 AM

DonQ playing Reggae with the bagpipes!

Nexus: I havent visited their site Woj to see if the article is readily available so I will sellect a section or too on the part about the alleged natural production, you enjoy a bit of science.

I agree there's a Kingdom of Heaven and Kingdoms of this world. The lion of this thread is the King of the kingdoms of this world. He is the imposter of the Lion of Judah of the former. The imposter has a false chosen people and a false true church.
The false chosen people are of two types, the athiests who
created the athiest state of Soviet Union and dominate Israel and the others are of the false Judaism which orginated in Babylon
just as the false church did. Only a minority of Jews are Torah Jews true to the Old Testament some of whom have in recent time publically protested in NY against the Zionist State of Israel
and have denounced the use/abuse of that name.
The NWO is bringing back the old Babylon empire whos original head was typed by a lion. You posted a lot of detail on their ancient religion some time back Woj.
A new World religion is being formed by the majority coming together in unity (including the Anglican Church) which is where your comment about the Vatican cooperating with world powers comes together and many expect the Pope to become the head of the world church of a mixture of all major religions. This isnt the Kingdom of God its the Kingdom of man. The Pope still has the old Babylonian title. Its purely academic. Peter was not the first Bishop of Rome and historical records show who was. The Vatican is a world religious, political and financial power, totally alien to the first believers/church in Jerusalem and outside anything Jesus said. Jesus didnt dress like a king and sit on a throne as the pope does.
Tupper Sausey has showed that Romes insignia is also on the US from its founding. It also carries the insignia of Satan worshiping secret societies.
Your conclusion is like saying all Nazis were German therefore all Germans are Nazi. Multi millions will agree with you but that merely makes it epidemic not academic. Apart from crowning the Imposters King of the lions.
Bush said he was in the Whitehouse to serve God. Is God bound by that?
Queen Elizabeth will no more rule over the head of the church than rule over Blair. WhiteHall will advise the Queen who she should appoint the Arch-Bishop of the Angican Church, just as the govt does the Knighthoods etc. The govt is ruled by the Crown corp - City of london, the international Banksters.
Many believe the head of the global elite is the Queen. But the Royal family has been under jewish financial advisers for a very long time and we can guess where that money would tied up and compromise the Royals. The Anglo-Saxons have provided a convenient cover for some time now. They will humble the US just as they did Britain, when they are ready. The majority of those who put their hand up for the presidency this time were mostly either jewish or have strong jewish links.
There has only been one Catholic president, which is very interesting. That doesnt represent the situation regards power.
I suspect that represents a situation relating to agreements of
boundaries relating to certain powers which is why another group are more prominant in politics and finance (and why possibly Kennedy had to go).

Jesus a critic of earthly events? Give us one quote. He only criticised the false teachings and the religious leaders which is why the Romans had no interest in him, as you said his business was to teach about the kingdom of heaven and he stuck to his brief. In fact the Romans could have welcomed a revival if it overthrew the *****ly lot they had to deal with that dominated Jerusalem if its head was not politically minded. Some of those who plotted his death may have feared that. We have been through the notion that he was like Ghandi and ML King before. He was no more like them than he was like the Pope. Check out the lives and crimes and morals of a number of Popes back in history, the stuff on which Sunday papers sell and they claim to have been representing God on earth. In fact they are currently drowning in sexual scandals.
Fooled by labels?

We have many choices and we are always saying vote with your feet and money. Notice the majority read/watch the bad media and vote for the corrupt main parties. Yet when they go into a fruitshop they do what we do. Only pick out the good ones.
The difference between one election/voting and another is the degree of interest to check it out first. If they cant be bothered they will vote/parot along with the majority or because their parents did or similar.
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#4096 donquijote

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Posted 09 October 2004 - 02:16 PM

Bader, forgive me I've been busy, but things are picking up in many fronts. Alberto from Italy is officially colaborating with me, and indeed supporting me in important contacts. For example, yesterday I contacted the new Nobel Prize Winner, Prof Maathai, from Kenya, who seems to have the same goals we do. Well he also wrote her telling her of his African background, etc. I don't put to much trust on any given contact, but at least the ball is on her side, and if she doesn't want to fight the big lions, then we know who it is--camouflage, you know...;)

Anyway this post reminded me of you emphasis on the financial aspect of the WATER WELL. And these are not kibbutz, but the REAL COOPS which require and investment and long term commitment...

> >The part that was skipped in the article explains it quite well. But
> >to use my own metaphor, the people's way is to form coops to build the
> >WATER WELL--looking not for cash crops but for self-sufficiency first
> >and quality of life later; the Nepad's way is to monopolize the water
> >in order to bottle it and market it in far away places without concern
> >for the thirsty little animals. :(
>
> People in Soweto looking for cash crops?
>
> Hey, can I buy you a farm in Eloff Street?

No, but perhaps you can build the WATER WELL in the city, I mean figuratively. The coops can be industrial and indeed we got models to turn to. I emphasize COOPERATIVES and not nationalized corporations. The former is democratic and is owned by the workers. The latter gives us a bureaucracy. It also promotes the water dam over the water well.

And this could be our model for the URBAN WATER WELL...

AMERICA DISCOVERS MONDRAGON

This, however, was soon to change, as Americans began to "discover" a unique European phenomenon. It was called "Mondragon", after the small, mountain-surrounded Basque town in which most of it was located. At that point, Mondragon was a 25-year-old association of worker owned and controlled enterprises that produced a wide range of high tech products from buses in robotics to refrigerators and stoves. It was more productive than its capital-controlled rivals in the same sectors. It was spinning off new, but always interconnected, coops at a remarkable rate, and had developed internal sources of health insurance, retirement benefits, and education and training.

Moreover, in the early 1960s, it had created a wholly novel (to us) economic institution, the Caja Laboral Popular, or "People's Labor Bank." The Caja functioned as an economic development vehicle. It enabled existing coops to expand and compete; and prospective ones to be carefully assessed and, if found feasible, to survive and prosper. The bank did all of this not only by making capital (deposited by both enterprises and local citizens) available at affordable rates, but by providing many types of business assistance to the networks cooperative firms.

What were the lessons that Mondragon taught? First, that workers themselves can be a source of capital, by reinvesting some or all of their profits as owners. The Mondragon coops insist that worker-owners invest in their own firms, first by agreeing to weekly deductions from wages, then by postponing their share of annual profits until they leave the firm. In these ways, worker-generated capital becomes available to reinvest in new or improved technology and additional lines of production.

Second, Mondragon was not a set of isolated or disconnected trees, but a mutually supportive forest. Firms were connected to other firms, through co-production and co- marketing, and as well to "support" organizations which provided them with essential forms of financial, business, legal, and educational assistance.

http://www.findartic...219/ai_21118491
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#4097 donquijote

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Posted 09 October 2004 - 02:22 PM

Bader, this fragment is also from the same website. The reason why they call themselves "socialists," I don't know, but I do know they have the right solution...

(Notice how coops are attacked from the socialist left as well as from the capitalist right);)

RELATED ARTICLE: HOW COOPS CAN CHANGE THE WORLD

We are socialist, because we believe that socialism would end the destructive market in human labor and the dominance of human affairs by capitalists. We advocate worker cooperatives because they give workers democratic control over profits, prevent concentration of capital in the hands of a few wealthy owners, and help us advance toward a classless society.

This make us unusual on the left. Most coop activists see worker ownership as a "third way" between capitalism and socialism. And many socialists believe that the way to socialism is through a political takeover of the state that leads to central planning - not through spreading workplace democracy. Socialists have several objections to a strategy based on coops, to each of which we respond below.

First, Karl Marx argued in 1864 that capitalists' political power would counteract any gains that coops might make. This has proven true! When capitalists have felt threatened by cooperatives, they have conducted economic war against coops by smear campaigns, supplier boycotts, sabotage, and, especially, denying credit to them. But such attacks can be overcome by emulating Mondragon in Spain - forming networks of coops which can assist each other, creating coop banks to provide financing, and financing their own coop suppliers.

A century ago Beatrice Potter voiced a second objection to worker coops. She examined dozens of British coops, finding that their lives were limited, either by failure or by selling out, when successful, to capitalist firms. But more recently Derek Jones reviewed Potter's cases, and found that the coops lasted at least as long as conventional firms in the same industries.

Third, Rosa Luxembourg argued that workers will never be able to raise the large amounts of capital needed to take over or start the large industries of modern economies. But there are four large-scale coop networks in the world today, all of which have had to accumulate large sums for investment. These include not only Mondragon, but the networks around Bologna in Italy which include over 150,000 worker-owners, the Coop Atlantic federation in Canada's maritime provinces, and Japan's Seikatsu network.

Finally, skeptics of coops say that as long as worker-owned businesses are operating under capitalism, they will compete with each other for markets and profits, and so continue to engage in exploitation. Only a planned economy can overcome the destructive dynamics of markets.

But coops do not have the same incentives to expand, and so fight for markets, as do capitalists. For capitalist firms, expansion can mean more profits per share of stock. For pure coops, expansion means more worker-owners as well as more revenues, so profits per worker-owner do not increase. Yet this only holds as long as coops do not hire wage labor (as Mondragon has done) - a principle for which activists must struggle.

Production for human needs, rather than profit, can only be fully realized through a democratically planned world economy. But building coop networks is the best first step toward that gold.
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#4098 donquijote

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Posted 09 October 2004 - 03:51 PM

Hey Bader, I updated this classification we've discussed before for Alberto. What do you think?;)

Alberto, you know I'm not a Marxist either, but let me explain how my theory (similar to Orwell's) helps explain it.

There IS a class struggle, but it's not so simple. The big animals who prey somehow on the little animals cannot be expected to help bring justice to the jungle, and even a shop owner with two proles-employes is likely to resist their "liberation," or simply COMPETITION from coops. Even bureaucrats are expected to behave that way. Accordingly they may be considered PART OF THE PROBLEM.

Now for the proles themselves. A 30% (based on nonscientific observation while handing out thousands of my pamphlet) side with the lion. They reject any news of a better world, and are content with their fate. Perhaps they themselves want to become lions. The rest, the 70%, is what represents the hope. What Orwell spoke about when he said, "the hope lies in the proles."

And what he said about the middle class (leonis minimus and medius) wanting to take over the upper class (leonis maximus) is evident.

There's though a rare breed out there--rara avis--who act out of ideals, and realize that freedom is a reward by itself. And they also know the jungle is unsustainable. That's us...;)

I've created this system to classify lions and the rest of the animals according to their hierarchy. They'll likely defend the jungle in proportion to their size, though sometimes there's conflict for power between lions. If there's any truth to the 'class struggle'--and I believe there is--this is also true...

-leonis maximus

-leonis medius

-leonis minimus

-other predators (foxes, hyenas, vultures, snakes, rats, etc, who either serve the lion or live off his scraps). Note: foxes often rule over the lion, since they control the money-strings...;)

-owl (scientist, often at the service of the lion in exchange for funding)

-rara avis (revolutionary, activist)

-little animals (the proles)

Any more ideas?:cool:

This article, comparing Orwell's animalism with Marxism, is very good, if you have a chance...

http://www.geocities...2074/orwell.htm
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#4099 donquijote

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Posted 09 October 2004 - 07:58 PM

"Peace must begin with each one of us. Through quiet and serious reflection on its meaning, new and creative ways can be found to foster understanding, friendships and cooperation among all peoples." Mr. Javier Perez de Cuellar, Former Secretary-General of the United Nations

<DonQ playing Reggae with the bagpipes!>

Sorry guys, but this revolution is aimed at the young--or at least to the young at heart.;)

We got a lion who's greedy...and old, or maybe the two go together. Perhaps is natural for a young idealist to turn into a greedy hypocrite later in life. Maybe it allows for survival in the jungle.:confused:

Then we need to reach the younger generations who like to love and dance--and who want to live. What do the older voters who put war-mongering, environment-hater Bush in power care about the future? Well, not enough, and they are bound to vote for him again. I have approached the young many times though and they agree with the statement JUSTICE FOR PEACE, since it makes sense, and they, you know, haven't developed yet vested interests. So, YES, there's a generation gap, and we need a change of generations.:cool:

And how do we reach them? Say through music, say through throwing a party? Perhaps we need to give them a chance, no?;)

Focusing on the Value of Peace!
Excerpts from
Living Values Activities for Young Adults

You Do Make a Difference
The world is an awful place for millions of people. There is corruption, cruelty, prejudice, and horrible poverty. There is a saying that everything is born in the mind of men - as humans we create the bad - and the good. People can and do make a difference. For the negativity to continue - we need do nothing. It takes real courage to think about what is going on - and change the intensity of your dislike of the negativity into determination to change it. Each one of you can contribute toward a better world.

http://www.livingval...oung_adults.htm
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#4100 Bader

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Posted 09 October 2004 - 11:08 PM

Howdy DonQ:

The Americans have been throwing a party, in fact two in one, they are democrat party and republican party.

You are right, the young need to be involved and political parties do have trouble attracting them and often are left to the older folk who are past doing much. Its a bit of a paradox, as those with the energy have young families that have first call on money and time and the older and wiser dont have the energy
but also tend to be died-in-the-wool after years of brainwashing by the two major parties that serve versted interests not public interest.
The difference today is that people at all levels are more able to see the phoneyness but the struggle is also increasing which causes people to embrace the opportunities to avoid being left behind which is how they become adapted to the jungle with tunnel vision so the dont see the downside, its all blotted out.
Problems are universal and complex as well so that makes it easier to forget about altruistic idealism and sanity. Then along comes "holywood'productions like the war on terror and WMD
to dazzle people and get their focus on a bigger threat.

COOPS:

I would try not to use the term "worker owned" as this sounds like a socialistic triumph, given that the majority of people have been duped into the dialectic materialistic thinking East and West.
We need to get people to think outside the square (head of the Lion).
Everyone knows of the downside of Capitalism and most people respect private enterprise that doesn exploit of monopolise. THat is what a COOP is, its a business multi-owned but the owners are hands on and responsible, unlike shareholder all over the world
with no responsibilkity for what their Bureacrats get up to. The legal enty of a business should go. It should be the entity of the individual, then all owners will be responsible. This legal coupe
over responsible enterpise is only about 100 years old. Golablism
and the freemarket with the right to be irrisponsible and plunder
has brough terror to every society almost.

THe "Related article: How Coops can change the world" is a good one and shows how the dialectic materialism works against
economic democracy. Both capitalism and socialism will fight it
to survive because it exposes their cultic myth and resulting bondage.
I have to go, will say more later.
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