Jump to content

Theme© by Fisana
 

Photo

What would it take for Russia to be #1?


  • Please log in to reply
7545 replies to this topic

#861 GIJOE

GIJOE

    Registered User

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 844 posts

Posted 27 August 2003 - 05:33 AM

When the Koreans came to America in the fifties, they all lived together in cramped quarters, they all worked 18 hours a day at something.They purchased many of the all night stores in the section of L A that suffered the worst harm during the riots.
The Koreans were burnt out to a tee, envy the blacks were faced with their own failure, The Koreans made them look bad, so they burnt them out.... truth and this is true of many different groups in the U S A today the Mexicans, most of them have two and three jobs.. I do not believe there are many Indians and Pakistanis on the welfare lines. Americas brothers and sisters must have and agenda to rise above resentment and old hatreds, and attain and education so that you can rise to your true potential. IT CAN HAPPEN IF YOU MAKE IT HAPPEN.


G I Joe
  • 0

#862 woj1@cyberonic.

woj1@cyberonic.

    Registered User

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 10667 posts

Posted 27 August 2003 - 08:08 AM

GIJOE;
I think that all Chinese also will agree with you. When they get to US, they will make this country honey and milk flowing. . "IT CAN HAPPEN IF YOU MAKE IT HAPPEN." Ha, ha ha. Indians and Pakistanis might be helpful as well.
  • 0

#863 woj1@cyberonic.

woj1@cyberonic.

    Registered User

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 10667 posts

Posted 27 August 2003 - 09:24 AM

GIJOE ; //Where is the answers to the questions about the vile deeds of the World wide Islamic Jihad movement.
And why is it that from you we never hear any type of admission of guilt about the terror groups hammas included from you and your ilk....//

The World wide Islamic Jihad movement is God blessing for Slavs. Thanks to this movement, imperialistic invasion on Slavs countries is halt.
Middle East conflict will never be solve as long you stay in Kosovo, and would not pay to Yugoslavia the war reparations. This is one person opinion, but you just wait
  • 0

#864 Bader

Bader

    Registered User

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1757 posts

Posted 27 August 2003 - 10:36 AM

Doesn't matter about post volumns, this thread is on the trot and takes a lot to stay in touch.

Woj suggested DonQ lacked human concern for others and how many times has he talked up support for the little animals? Hey
come on! The Ehrenriech book review says it all as well.

China and the U.S. are on a collision course and the pre-emptive strike will just about throw away any reverse gear, is how I see it.
In regards the new Japan (China)of the new century I think WOJ had it
about right at this stage at least - " People with money sell for a profit the things people without money make and in turn use this money to hire more people to make more..." A NIke shoe made in China is still a Nike shoe.

Decentralization makes democracy stronger, because the people own it. That is why the Swiss are strong inspite of the fact their defence forces are less centralized than others. When people don't believe in their war forced on them by a centralized power
they aren't as strong. Did centralized Russia win after twenty years of war against decentralised Afghs. Viet Nam? Today they are saying the same in Iraq.

Woj, NZ isn't strong militarily, its pitiful. The present gov has simply opted for an insurance policy of being a servant of the U.N. and trying to put a handful of peacekeepers all over the world
out of an army of a few thousand. That's why they turned down
a good offer for some F16s. It has just got some armoured personel carriers from Canada that are hopeless in rough terrain. Someone asked in a local paper were they just for
civilian control then?

The comments by the Prof at La Trobe Uni in Australia about the pre-emptive strike- the only part I didn't like was his liberal slight of hand that supposed that the U.N. was the arbiter of right and wrong!

GIJ, You are the first person to raise issues regarding the so-called jihard against the UK and U.S.A on this thread about Russia so your excitement was uncalled for. However if it is over the fact that there is a lot of criticism of the U.S. and the quotes are usually from people in the U.S. and you think Hamas should be straightened out first. The difference is that Hamas doesn't pretend what its doing is good for their victims, cover up evidence or make up stories to justify its violence against others.
It has been alleged that Hamas was financed by Israel to divide the militant opposition to prevent it from becoming too strong while keeping the little fires burning. The U.S. is becoming everything the founding fathers tried to leave behind in Europe and Britain.

DonQ that book of Ehrenreich is another story about the twenty percent winning and the eighty percent loosing and poverty moving upwards. Even though Kalahari desert people could make it possible to survive in that state of affairs is no recommmendation to retain it. The other side of the coin of the saying 'it can (not will, how many failures to every one that succeeds?) happen if you make it happen" (can we all be like Bill Gates?) - is that the multi-nationals also believe the same and have more going for them against the others.
A NZ MP decided back about the mid nineties to prove one could live on the dole, she gave up after two or three weeks, nothing said. Hope doesn't keep one warm in wniter or fortify the immunity systems etc, but that abundance all about can but for the cunning in the systems.
  • 0

#865 woj1@cyberonic.

woj1@cyberonic.

    Registered User

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 10667 posts

Posted 27 August 2003 - 10:41 AM

donquijote;
There are no facts only interpretation? ;
Although everything what is not Slavic is worse sort , I have to admit that I like Michal Crichton. I want to mention
  • 0

#866 donquijote

donquijote

    Registered User

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 3919 posts

Posted 27 August 2003 - 01:20 PM

<When the Koreans came to America in the fifties, they all lived together in cramped quarters, they all worked 18 hours a day at something.They purchased many of the all night stores in the section of L A that suffered the worst harm during the riots.
The Koreans were burnt out to a tee, envy the blacks were faced with their own failure, The Koreans made them look bad, so they burnt them out.... truth and this is true of many different groups in the U S A today the Mexicans, most of them have two and three jobs..>

Common sense tells me that all can't rise to the top under the law of the jungle. Of course some predators--because they are workaholics or lucky whatever--do rise but the rest of the little animals are left without shelter. It's like everything is set up for the predators but not for the prey. In Scandinavia though those most vulnerable--and necessary for the well being of society--are protected: mother and child.

Their benefits include a year of paid maternity leave, free daycare--with the option not to send the child and get a check--and free education up to higher education...

That's what I call a civilized jungle if not more...;)

< I do not believe there are many Indians and Pakistanis on the welfare lines. Americas brothers and sisters must have and agenda to rise above resentment and old hatreds, and attain and education so that you can rise to your true potential. IT CAN HAPPEN IF YOU MAKE IT HAPPEN.>

Not even, as evidenced by the recent cuts in education...:confused:

http://webspawner.com/users/donquijote
  • 0

#867 donquijote

donquijote

    Registered User

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 3919 posts

Posted 27 August 2003 - 02:40 PM

See what I mean? No lion, just maybe a lioness...;)

I'd have some cautious optimism, the reason being is that something can go wrong unless we stop the lion or dominator model.

In this analysis Ms Eisler (I like what I've read from her so far) argues that the dominator can be "tamed," such as is the case in Scandinavia. Another interesting point of the article is the sex-spirituality link which I totally favor. Though I embrace Gandhi's nonviolence, I'm not enthusiastic about repressing sexuality. Perhaps the opposite is true...

LONDON: You referred to the shift that took place as we moved from a social order based on partnership and equality to one based on domination and violence. Your research suggests that this shift was one of the defining moments of our history as a species. How did you come to that realization?

EISLER: Well, it was really through the process of simple observation, free from what I think of as "the blinkers" that have impeded scientists from seeing the whole picture. My model is one that takes a dynamic view of human society and culture, and what I began to see in my historical research were patterns that had not been visible before -- connections between different elements of social systems. For example, I saw that in tribal societies and in highly advanced industrialized societies, the more that society was rigidly male-dominated, the more it went along with a strong-man-rule approach in the family and the state, and the more it accepted institutionalized social violence -- from child-beating and wife-beating to warfare -- as part of the social system.

As you move to the other side of the spectrum -- say, for example, the Scandinavian bloc countries in our time where you have a much more equal partnership between men and women -- you find a guidance-system of more stereotypically feminine values. There is funding for "women's work" -- taking care of children, caring for people's health, caring for the environment. There is economic and political democracy. It is not coincidental that the first peace academies came out of the Scandinavian bloc countries. Why? Because they are oriented more to the partnership configuration.

This model has been very useful to many people around the world for getting beyond the old categories which don't help us, such as capitalist vs. communist, the developed world and the developing world, and so on.

http://www.scottlond...pts/eisler.html
  • 0

#868 Pliny

Pliny

    Registered User

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 3587 posts

Posted 27 August 2003 - 03:46 PM

EISLER: Well, it was really through the process of simple observation, free from what I think of as "the blinkers" that have impeded scientists from seeing the whole picture. My model is one that takes a dynamic view of human society and culture, and what I began to see in my historical research were patterns that had not been visible before -- connections between different elements of social systems. For example, I saw that in tribal societies and in highly advanced industrialized societies, the more that society was rigidly male-dominated, the more it went along with a strong-man-rule approach in the family and the state, and the more it accepted institutionalized social violence -- from child-beating and wife-beating to warfare -- as part of the social system.

So social violence was "institutionalized"?? What does that mean?

No one has ever approved of social violence that I can recall. Get a handle on things.

Eisler makes the assumption that because someone has told you of violence or you may have even witnessed some violence that you have a complete understanding of any given violent situation.

By attempting the wholesale elimination of violence by restraint or law is assinine.

It is sometimes necessary. Ever been at the other end of a 45 in a corner store? Or have somebody rip your purse off your shoulder? The law today would prefer to incarcerate you if you retaliate in any manner.

We are not violent because we are civilized and can reason - when reason fails, violence can be, but is not necessarily, the outcome.

Both our civilization and our reasoning can be improved upon but attempting to crush violence out of existence, by law or government, is a ludicrous venture.

Some social scientist, like Eisler, who finally took her "blinkers" off and can see the whole picture with a clarity missed by all others is really living in her own little world, and as I said, assumes an understanding of all violent incidents when all she has really done
is put all violence into one big boiling pot and is attempting to put a lid on it. The build-up of pressure from that approach to stop violence will eventually blow.

This shows a real lack of an understanding of human dynamics and interaction. It of course will be sucked up as gospel by the politically correct, the weak, and those, like Eisler, with an inability to observe and whose solutions condemn us to state rule form cradle to grave which, in her tiny little mind, is what all of us deserve.
  • 0

#869 GIJOE

GIJOE

    Registered User

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 844 posts

Posted 27 August 2003 - 04:25 PM

Originally posted by Pliny
EISLER: Well, it was really through the process of simple observation, free from what I think of as "the blinkers" that have impeded scientists from seeing the whole picture. My model is one that takes a dynamic view of human society and culture, and what I began to see in my historical research were patterns that had not been visible before -- connections between different elements of social systems. For example, I saw that in tribal societies and in highly advanced industrialized societies, the more that society was rigidly male-dominated, the more it went along with a strong-man-rule approach in the family and the state, and the more it accepted institutionalized social violence -- from child-beating and wife-beating to warfare -- as part of the social system.

So social violence was "institutionalized"?? What does that mean?

No one has ever approved of social violence that I can recall. Get a handle on things.

Eisler makes the assumption that because someone has told you of violence or you may have even witnessed some violence that you have a complete understanding of any given violent situation.

By attempting the wholesale elimination of violence by restraint or law is assinine.

It is sometimes necessary. Ever been at the other end of a 45 in a corner store? Or have somebody rip your purse off your shoulder? The law today would prefer to incarcerate you if you retaliate in any manner.

We are not violent because we are civilized and can reason - when reason fails, violence can be, but is not necessarily, the outcome.

Both our civilization and our reasoning can be improved upon but attempting to crush violence out of existence, by law or government, is a ludicrous venture.

Some social scientist, like Eisler, who finally took her "blinkers" off and can see the whole picture with a clarity missed by all others is really living in her own little world, and as I said, assumes an understanding of all violent incidents when all she has really done
is put all violence into one big boiling pot and is attempting to put a lid on it. The build-up of pressure from that approach to stop violence will eventually blow.

This shows a real lack of an understanding of human dynamics and interaction. It of course will be sucked up as gospel by the politically correct, the weak, and those, like Eisler, with an inability to observe and whose solutions condemn us to state rule form cradle to grave which, in her tiny little mind, is what all of us deserve.



ALL A CONSERVATIVE IS, IS A LIBERAL THAT HAS BEEN MUGGED.


G I Joe
  • 0

#870 woj1@cyberonic.

woj1@cyberonic.

    Registered User

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 10667 posts

Posted 27 August 2003 - 05:27 PM

Re: DonQ INNOVATIVE;


America is the only nation in history which miraculously has gone directly from barbarism to degeneration without the usual interval of civilization.
  • 0

#871 GIJOE

GIJOE

    Registered User

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 844 posts

Posted 27 August 2003 - 06:22 PM

Originally posted by woj1@cyberonic.
Re: DonQ INNOVATIVE;


America is the only nation in history which miraculously has gone directly from barbarism to degeneration without the usual interval of civilization. v Georges Clemenceau


Natural ability without education has more often raised a man to glory and virtue, than education without natural ability- Cicero.



G I Joe says cyberonic moronic chronic liar and in need of dire education of the true facts......

America is and has been the bastion of freedom for the worlds oppressed. mentally challenged woj,,,,


G I Joe
  • 0

#872 Bader

Bader

    Registered User

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1757 posts

Posted 27 August 2003 - 08:23 PM

Of the last four posts, I can agree with Pliny re Eisler, just another
liberal in my view who seems to have taken a blinker off one eye.
That's a strange overview of the U.S. WOJ, I prefer GIJ but the present tense is about to expire, the biggest jihard is behind their backs.
  • 0

#873 vladzo

vladzo

    Registered User

  • Banned
  • PipPipPip
  • 16824 posts

Posted 27 August 2003 - 11:34 PM

to dom keyhowtee:::::

it is not russian to worry about number one.

number one in ?????? WHAT ???????

shto to yest #1

moye zhetja moye
tvoye zhetja tvoye
kto to yset #1
gde to yest #1

#vlad
  • 0

#874 GIJOE

GIJOE

    Registered User

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 844 posts

Posted 28 August 2003 - 12:13 AM

Originally posted by vladzo
to dom keyhowtee:::::

it is not russian to worry about number one.

number one in ?????? WHAT ???????

shto to yest #1

moye zhetja moye
tvoye zhetja tvoye
kto to yset #1
gde to yest #1

#vlad



the number that comes before number 2.. good luck on your math and english.

G I Joe
  • 0

#875 Bader

Bader

    Registered User

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1757 posts

Posted 28 August 2003 - 08:19 AM

Howdy Vladzo,

It's an open book. You can make it what you want.
You can make it happen if you make it happen.
Anything from crossword masters to crosscountry swimming.
But originally the popular choice was best place to live as opposed to being the heavyweight military champion of the world.
  • 0

#876 woj1@cyberonic.

woj1@cyberonic.

    Registered User

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 10667 posts

Posted 28 August 2003 - 10:48 AM

re; The Short and Long of it all
//Doesn't matter about pos Woj suggested DonQ lacked human concern for others and how many times has he talked up support for the little animals? //
You get me right. I have never stated support for the little animals. In contrary, I say that little animal created the lion. No little animals, no lion. So to hell with little animals! Ha, ha ha.

//In regards the new Japan (China)of the new century I think
  • 0

#877 woj1@cyberonic.

woj1@cyberonic.

    Registered User

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 10667 posts

Posted 28 August 2003 - 12:57 PM

donquijote;
Why do you call for money on education?.
Main purpose of education is to instruct how to control the human behavior.
Example how to train people;
"Dogs restrained in Pawlovian harnesses were conditioned to respond to a tone signaling a painful shock which they could not escape. The next day the dogs were put into a two-compartment apparatus where they were to learn the simple instrumental response of jumping over a barrier to escape a shock they received in the e first compartment. Control dogs that had not received the prior conditioning quickly learned to avoid the shock. In starting contrast , two thirds of the dogs that had experiencd the inescapable shock the day before seemed to give up and accept it rather than learning to escape. Even if one of these dogs did occasionally escape by jumping over the barrier, on the next trial it would simply sit there and take the shock. "/ Unraveling the Mystery of Human Behavior- Emotion and Cognitive Control) .
Next steps are very simple ; We already have knowledge about instrumental conditioning, instrumental response and now we can replicated with human beings. Ha, ha ha.
  • 0

#878 donquijote

donquijote

    Registered User

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 3919 posts

Posted 28 August 2003 - 02:02 PM

<This shows a real lack of an understanding of human dynamics and interaction. It of course will be sucked up as gospel by the politically correct, the weak, and those, like Eisler, with an inability to observe and whose solutions condemn us to state rule form cradle to grave which, in her tiny little mind, is what all of us deserve. >

I think her comments are very important. Nowhere she claims that her solution--though I've saying that for a long time--will be absolute. In fact after the following article--someone has the book?--she admits that it would NOT erradicate conflict absolutely, but that it would make it far more unlikely, something perhaps as unlikely as a war between Sweden and Denmark...;)

Source: book 'You Are Being Lied To'; article 'Will the Real Human Please Stand Up?' by Riane Eisler. Fragments.

Humanity at the Crossroads

Today the mix of the dominator model and advanced technology become increasingly unsustainable, the blade is the nuclear bomb and/or biological warfare and terrorism [written before Sept. 11!]. Increasingly advanced technologies in the service of a dominator ethos threaten our natural habitat, as well as that of most species with whom we share our planet.

Regions ranging from the former Soviet Union to countries is Asia, Africa and Latin America are being forced into a replay of the robber-baron days of early capitalism.

In sum, the outcome of the tension between the partnership and dominator models as two basic human possibilities is far from settled. We are now at what scientists call a bifurcation point, where there are two very different scenarios for out future.

One is 'dominator system breakdown': the unsustainable future of high technology guided by the dominator model [the Lion]. This is where high technology in service of the domination of nature despoils and pollutes our natural habitat. It is a future where advanced technologies will be used not to free our human potentials, but to more effectively control and dominate. And ultimately, it is a future of environmental, nuclear, or biological holocaust.

The other scenario is 'breakthrough to partnership': the sustainable future of a world primarily orienting to the partnership model [for the benefit of all species]. Here advanced technologies are developed and used in ways that promote environmental balance and the realization of our species' great untapped potentials. International regulations ensure corporate accountability to workers, communities and natural habitats. [I'd add here the promotion of cooperatives as an option to counterbalance corporations.] New economic institutions and rules recognize the value of the work of caring and caregiving, and discourage violence, exploitation, and the despoliation of nature.

http://webspawner.com/users/donquijote
  • 0

#879 donquijote

donquijote

    Registered User

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 3919 posts

Posted 28 August 2003 - 02:29 PM

<You get me right. I have never stated support for the little animals. In contrary, I say that little animal created the lion. No little animals, no lion. So to hell with little animals! Ha, ha ha.>

Has anyone told by any chance that you roar, I mean snore at night? Do you like to eat the little animals? Do you want to keep the little animals little?

A "yes" to any of those questions would make you a lion...;)

<I wrote about defense, not about democracy. Regarding democracy I agree with Plato that ?the democratic principle of government is absurd.- ? The ruler must govern in virtue of knowledge. ?>

So you favor a lion to rule the world. Which one, the Lion King or Scar?;)

< Bush also tries to get UN peacekeepers but now with all money US lost, Bush is much more pitiful than government of New Zealand. >

Hey we agree on something!

<Anyway I expect that he is a mystery for you both of you ; ha, ha ha>

It ain't so much that I don't know about him, it's that I don't care...;)

Do you think this is a smart quote? (Pehaps it's something common to the Georges);)

"My home policy: I wage war; my foreign policy: I wage war. All the time I wage war."
ATTRIBUTION: Georges Clemenceau (1841
  • 0

#880 donquijote

donquijote

    Registered User

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 3919 posts

Posted 28 August 2003 - 02:36 PM

<It's an open book. You can make it what you want.
You can make it happen if you make it happen.
Anything from crossword masters to crosscountry swimming.
But originally the popular choice was best place to live as opposed to being the heavyweight military champion of the world. >

Howdy Bader

Exactly. The little animals are fed the line that there's little they can do to change the world or that perhaps only God can change things. The lions though are doers and they have built a world to their liking.

What a pity that such an a Lion's Utopia dooms us all...:confused:
  • 0




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users

Copyright © 2016 Pravda.Ru