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Eurozone on verge of collapse


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#1 Spud

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Posted 28 November 2010 - 11:14 AM

Growing political resistance in Ireland and Germany to handing over money to banks is forcing the ECB to buy up souvereign debt

Hyperinflation is logical result of the crumbling eurozone pyramid scheme

German economists suggest creating a eurozone with two currencies

Merkel admits that the euro collapse could spell the end of the Globalist
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#2 dolphin

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Posted 28 November 2010 - 11:22 AM

A lovely melody...

Great read...
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#3 belisarius

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Posted 28 November 2010 - 12:23 PM

There is little mystery to this scenario.

Iceland, whose banks' astronomical leverage brought that country down was a foretaste of what some countries are experiencing now. Ireland itself enjoyed the highest growth for several years in the EU. So did Spain.

Currency per se has some, but not all the bearing on it. When the things went well EUR helped, once the things turned sour it acted as a chain-ball.

In the final analysis what all these governments (of the PIIGS countries) have to do is to default and protect their people.

That would be an entirely novel idea: transfer of wealth back to the people.
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#4 Spud

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Posted 28 November 2010 - 02:24 PM

There is little mystery to this scenario.

Iceland, whose banks' astronomical leverage brought that country down was a foretaste of what some countries are experiencing now. Ireland itself enjoyed the highest growth for several years in the EU. So did Spain.

Currency per se has some, but not all the bearing on it. When the things went well EUR helped, once the things turned sour it acted as a chain-ball.

In the final analysis what all these governments (of the PIIGS countries) have to do is to default and protect their people.

That would be an entirely novel idea: transfer of wealth back to the people.


Yup, default is the only logical answer.
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#5 Mandrake

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Posted 28 November 2010 - 02:38 PM

Boy, I remember when I first came here 7 years ago how the Europeans on this board were crowing about their Euro and how the Eurozone was going to destroy the US and we would be using their Euro as currency.

How the mighty have fallen.:lol:
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#6 belisarius

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Posted 28 November 2010 - 02:43 PM

Boy, I remember when I first came here 7 years ago


Where were you until then? Just Southern Illinois?
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#7 vigorous

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Posted 28 November 2010 - 02:45 PM

Economist Barry Eichengreen discusses books on Europe and the Euro. Believes single currency will survive current crisis. "The more I contemplated scenarios of possible exits from the euro, the more I concluded it wouldn't happen"

.........

Let's face it.

We're in the peanut gallery.
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#8 belisarius

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Posted 28 November 2010 - 02:56 PM

.........

Let's face it.

We're in the peanut gallery.


Most people here are mistaking the symptom for the cause.
If it weren't EUR it would have been some other currency.
It's the debt (leverage), not the currency it's denominated in, that
has brought this calamity upon PIIGS.
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#9 vigorous

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Posted 28 November 2010 - 02:59 PM

I don't even pretend to understand it.
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#10 Mandrake

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Posted 28 November 2010 - 03:05 PM

Where were you until then? Just Southern Illinois?


The Midwest Corkboard. It was a rural forum filled with families, retirees and little old ladies. We would all get together in different towns and have potluck dinners together.

As for the families, it was interesting to read the jabber between mothers and their college kids and grandparents chiming in.
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#11 dolphin

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Posted 28 November 2010 - 03:18 PM

Most people here are mistaking the symptom for the cause.
If it weren't EUR it would have been some other currency.
It's the debt (leverage), not the currency it's denominated in, that
has brought this calamity upon PIIGS.



Why would anyone think what has happened is anything different than what happened to cause last Great Depression? It was orchestrated.

In laymans terms it really is quite easy to grasp.

Essentially to cause financial trouble the Conspirators create massive debt problems by various means.

The housing bubble in the United States was one of them, but actually just a small part of the recipe they prepared to create this mess.

Dirivatives!!! Most people forget the case of Michael Milken years ago. The big junk bond scandal. He went to prison for it. He devised a new way to create a massive fortune out of thin air basically.

They made it illegal to do what he did for the private citizen, but Greenspan took his idea and made it legal for the Institutional Banking practices to get away with it so that only the biggest players
in the game could involve themselves with that form of investment.

When Michael Milken did it they put him in prison and what he did they made illegal illegal for a very good reason. They knew what would happen if more private citizens became involved in that type of high finance.

They also knew that by allowing the highest levels of financial institutions to engage in similar practices it would eventually cause the same problem, but since the FED controlled the Banking Industry not only could
they manage the scam, but with their secrecy rules they could hide all the irregularities even from a prying Congress which they control anyway.

They also knew that they would use the problem to cause a global financial meltdown when they were ready to kick it off. Knowing that in advance allowed all the insiders to buy all their gold years ago at rock bottom prices.

It was elementary how to manipulate that bubble into collapsing.

Making massive risky loans available to the public was part of it, but just like in the Great Depression they knew that by restricting the supply of money available for loans that businesses need to operate it would bring things ever closer to the edge.

The massive burden of the bloated US military budget to fuel the wars they had to know would put things over the edge eventually. They also knew that the key to bringing down the global house of cards was to destroy the economic feasability of the United States since the whole world pretty much based their economy on the Dollar.

Add to all that 20 years of intentional deindustrialization of the United States destroying the job market.

It was a very well laid out plan and very well executed.

Massive layoffs and unemployment leads to massive loan defaults and an increasing faultering economy without as many people being able to afford to buy anything, or pay taxes to service the debt.

The result is massive bank forclosures allowing the conspirators to centralize their monopoly on the banking Industry while at the same time forclosing on vast amounts of privately owned property. They have been wanting to do away with private property ownership anyway so that kills two birds with one stone. Everything they do overlaps killing multiple birds with one stone.

End result is massive poverty with people too desperate trying to survive day to day to have the time, or inclination to quaral with their government as their rights are taken away
and they are herded into accepting a police state.

Global destruction of the middle class and massive poverty resulting in famine and disiese to drastically increase the global mortality rates (particularly in third world countries) to further
their depopulation agenda.

Then they justify all these austerity programs to further reduce everyones standard of living while at the same time they print up vast sums of FIAT currency
to keep things going which devalues all our currencies essentially stealing the savings of the global middle class by the inflation caused by it.

All in all it was a brilliant plan and carried out very smoothly over a long enough period of time so most people can't even put it all together.

Edited by dolphin, 28 November 2010 - 04:30 PM.

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#12 belisarius

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Posted 28 November 2010 - 03:28 PM

Why would anyone think what has happened is anything different than what happened to cause last Great Depression? It was orchestrated.

In laymans terms it really is quite easy to grasp.

Essentially to cause financial trouble the Conspirators create massive debt problems by various means.

The housing bubble in the United States was one of them, but actually just a small part of the recipe they prepared to create this mess.

Dirivatives!!! Most people forget the case of Michael Milken years ago. The big junk bond scandal. He went to prison for it. He devised a new way to create a massive fortune out of thin air basically.

They made it illegal to do what he did for the private citizen, but Greenspan took his idea and made it legal for the Institutional Banks to get away with it so that only the biggest players in the game could involve themselves in the game.

When Michael Milken did it they put him in prison and what he did they made illegal illegal for a very good reason. They knew what would happen if more private citizens became involved in that type of high finance.

They also knew that by allowing the highest levels of financial institutions to engage in similar practices it would eventually cause a bubble.

It was elementary how to manipulate that bubble into collapsing.

Making massive risky loans available to the public was part of it, but just like in the Great Depression they knew that by restricting the supply of money avaialble for loans that businesses need to operate it would bring things ever closer to the edge.

The massive burden of the bloated US military budget to fuel the wars they had to know would put things over the edge eventually. They also knew that the key to bringing down the global house of cards was to destroy the economic feasability of the United States since the whole world pretty much based their economy on the Dollar.

Add to all that 20 years of intentional deindustrialization of the United States destroying the job market.

It was a very well laid out plan and very well executed.


You mention many familiar things that ring true. Most of them are, actually, unrelated. Milken is more famous for the "junk bonds," "kitchen sinks" and the like, rather than the derivatives. The lethal aspect of the derivatives burst on the scene with the bankruptcy of the Orange County, CA, under Bob Citron. Merrill Lynch settled some charges.

Your overall claim of a conspiracy is not plausible.
It is much easier to explain the problem by the greed and stupidity of some who chose to participate, to the benefit of the smart ones.
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#13 dolphin

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Posted 28 November 2010 - 03:48 PM

You mention many familiar things that ring true. Most of them are, actually, unrelated. Milken is more famous for the "junk bonds," "kitchen sinks" and the like, rather than the derivatives. The lethal aspect of the derivatives burst on the scene with the bankruptcy of the Orange County, CA, under Bob Citron. Merrill Lynch settled some charges.

Your overall claim of a conspiracy is not plausible.
It is much easier to explain the problem by the greed and stupidity of some who chose to participate, to the benefit of the smart ones.



I was still editing my post when you replied. You missed a few things, but what you did not miss and are making a very big mistake not comprehending is that Greenspan did indeed use
Michael Milkens methods of creative financing and applied them to the Dirivative Market and what is more he made it legal, but only for the Institutional players.

Of course its easy to explain as greed and stupidity. That is the beuty of the whole conspiracy. The guilty conspirators who scripted the meltdown will never be prosicuted because of all the finger pointing.

They will however enjoy the vast fruits of their scam while everyone else gets poorer by the day.

I'll be the first to admit I gave an incomplete oversimplified version of events, but I guarantee you if you can comprehend the general idea of what I am describing as having happened you should be
able to recognize that stupidity had absolutely nothing to do with it.

Edited by dolphin, 28 November 2010 - 03:55 PM.

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#14 babau

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Posted 28 November 2010 - 04:01 PM

You mention many familiar things that ring true. Most of them are, actually, unrelated. Milken is more famous for the "junk bonds," "kitchen sinks" and the like, rather than the derivatives. The lethal aspect of the derivatives burst on the scene with the bankruptcy of the Orange County, CA, under Bob Citron. Merrill Lynch settled some charges.

Your overall claim of a conspiracy is not plausible.
It is much easier to explain the problem by the greed and stupidity of some who chose to participate, to the benefit of the smart ones.

Hii Belli..u fool with 30years of banking biz..:lol:
..i do think Dolph`s is quite right..& u wrong..
..&..as what is "junk-bond" other than derivate to "real" bond..no?

so whole event described by words of Dolph is quite accurate..lol

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#15 ancient nation

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Posted 28 November 2010 - 04:07 PM

Boy, I remember when I first came here 7 years ago how the Europeans on this board were crowing about their Euro and how the Eurozone was going to destroy the US and we would be using their Euro as currency.

How the mighty have fallen.:lol:

not me boyo...but all euro azzholes were indeed gloating over euro and EU...another post posy euro/soviet bureucracy...doomed to fail...the soonner zi better...:viva:
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#16 belisarius

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Posted 28 November 2010 - 05:28 PM

[I]
..&..as what is "junk-bond" other than derivate to "real" bond..no?


Yes! No, junk bond is not a derivative. It's a real bond, with a low credit rating, whence the nick-name "junk," implying a relatively high rate of default, and, as a consequence, a high rate of interest it pays.

All over-the-counter derivatives are AAA (the highest available) rated.
I do not expect you to understand the difference between the "exchange traded" and "over-the-counter" derivatives, as I do not expect you to understand what "notional amount" is.

You should not confuse the access to Pravda and ability to post with understanding certain things. When it comes to the issue at hand you are illiterate, to be charitable about it.

Edited by belisarius, 28 November 2010 - 05:39 PM.

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#17 dolphin

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Posted 30 November 2010 - 01:11 AM

Yes! No, junk bond is not a derivative. It's a real bond, with a low credit rating, whence the nick-name "junk," implying a relatively high rate of default, and, as a consequence, a high rate of interest it pays.



I never suggested they were the same. I was merely pointing out the fact that Greenspan applied the same kind of creative financing practices in the Dirivitives market that Milken used in the Junk Bond scandal and made it legal, but only for the Institutional level players.

It should have never been allowed for the same exact reasons they prosicuted Milken for doing it, but the FED has a free hand and operates in secret which made it very easy for them to hide what they were doing. It also made it very easy for them to crash the global economy whenever they chose to which is exactly what they did.

Lets not forget that the FED is an entity that exists under the same sphere of influence as the IMF and World Bank and ultimately they all follow directives handed down to them by the Oligarchs who own the Bank of International Settlements (BIS) and who also direct the WTO Policies. The very same families of bastards who with their goons and puppets manipulated the world into both of the last two world wars and God only knows how much other evil.

These bastards use peons who carry out their marching orders in the public eye. Parasitic Idiots who make a career out of working in the Banking Industry who carry out their crimes for them and that is why they can never be prosicuted. The laws we live by were written in such a way that they are shielded from the crimes they subject us to. To such monsters we are nothing but cattle to be culled at their whim.


Greg Palast confronts the leaders of the World Bank

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DrynBzUpyag&feature=player_embedded




This short video describes their mentality best.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oWaPXVoy68o

Edited by dolphin, 30 November 2010 - 03:29 AM.

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#18 dolphin

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Posted 30 November 2010 - 03:29 AM

To steal millions, you need a top team of armed robbers. But to steal trillions, you need PhD's
with color charts and economic projections made of fairy dust and eye of newt and last,
but not least a magical thing called a computer-generated spreadsheet .
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#19 Spud

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Posted 30 November 2010 - 04:19 AM

Germany
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