Quotes - Jewish and American.
Posted 05 May 2003 - 03:49 AM
Posted 05 May 2003 - 09:44 PM
At the build up of the Iraq war I could see no logical strategic reason for there to be war, so I started looking on the internet for irrational illogical reasons. Some evidence is verifiable, much circumstantial. But all the circumstantial evidence points the same way, and I do not find evidence to the contrary. Further the evidence all seems to be consistent with a pattern.
Now, Houlin; you tell me that something I have always believed was constructively falsified, and I have no reason to disbelieve you.
Instinctively I believe you.
Logically you appear totally rational and reasonable. Your critism of me when you flamed me re. Marx was totally reasonable, informed, and logical.
The implication of what you say appears to indicate that this has been going on at least since the end of WWII, and probably since the beginning of WWII.
When I have gone away from this computer and this ghastly thing, one would like to imagine one is dreaming and it is not as bad as it appears. Then I see your post and I am confronted with facing evidence that it is real.
As to the question: - "What is real torah Judaism?" I do not really know. Throughout so much literature it appears to me that what is "good" and "evil" appears to be highly variable. Also at various times I think that the entities refered to as "G_d" and "angels" are in fact entirely different. For example in the destruction of Soddom and Gomorrah, Lot invites the "angels" into his house, and they eat and drink. Later they physically deposit him outside the city. In Diane Fortunes books on spiritualism, an angel is a sort of unchanging being who does not evolve, but has a massive intelligence. And G_d is the summation of all souls including guardian beings e.g. "The nine". According to concepts of sharmanism, there has been a very long dance between the male and female aspects of G_d.
From the legends of Babylon, and apparently many areas of the Mediterean, according to Robert Temples book "The Sirius Mystery" we hear of the amphibian being "Oannes"
Surviving fragments of the Babylonian History written in greek by a priest named Berossus, describe Oannes closely: "the whole body of the animal was like that of a fish; and it had a fish's tail. His voice too, and language, were articulate and human;and a representation of him is preserved to this day... When the sun set it was the custom of this being to plunge again into the sea, and abide all night in the deep; for he was amphibious." Quote from "The World Atlas of Mysteries" by Francis Hitching, published by Collins ISBN 0 00 211999 4
Further this book lists sites around the Aegian, with ten named sites. e.g. 7) Home of the prophetic amphibian god Glaucus("Grey Green"), who taught divination to Apollo, the greek god of prophephy, and the owner of the Oracle at Delphi.
Richard Temple "The Sirius Mystery" ISBN 0 8600 7502 8 Paperback. Futura Publications Limited.
Later we hear no mention of similar beings. But in Exodus Moses sees the burning bush (always strikes me this is similar to the description of ball lightning") Then we get the descent of "G_d" to the mountain replete with thunder and smoke.
The Ten Commandments sound correct. But a lot of the rest of the Pentateuch;Sacrifice, etc seems strange to me. Then we keep hearing a lot about the arc of the holy covenant, until sometime in or after King Solomons reign there is no further mention of it.
I have to admit this has given me problems in that I have had to question things I have always taken for granted. I mean Christian seem to go out of their way to explain it which results in an interpretation of thir own making. Some of Genesis seems to be an asemblage of myths from Babylon, and in other parts I think they may have written down what they saw.
Therefore I just try to do what Jesus told us to do, perhaps not very well. But that does not answer what real torah Judaism is.
Posted 05 May 2003 - 10:57 PM
"After the first World War, Jewish gangsters became major figures in the American underworld and played prominent roles in the creation and extension of organized crime in the United States. During Prohibition fifty percent of the leading bootleggers were Jews, and Jewish criminals financed and directed much of the nation's narcotics traffic. Jews also dominated illicit activities in a number of America's largest cities, including Boston, Cleveland, Detroit, Minneapolis, New York, and Philadelphia. "
"The Jewish Almanac", Bantam Boooks, 1980, page 58:
"It would not be an exaggeration to say that their [the Jewish Gangsters] influence on organized crime in the United States during the 1920?s and 1930?s rivaled, if not exceeded, that of their Italian counterparts."
Peace be unto you "inside bush".
Posted 05 May 2003 - 10:58 PM
Jewish Telegraphic Agency, 03/29/2000
JOHANNESBURG, March 29 (JTA) - The "Israeli mafia" has made headlines in South Africa following the recent discovery of the body of an alleged member of the group.
Shai Avishar, 36, disappeared from the trendy Johannesburg suburb of Norwood last October. His body was discovered in a shallow grave some 40 miles away following a tip-off to police.
A South African police spokesman said the group posed no threat to the local Jewish community or other South African Jews.
The spokesman added that a member of the police investigating the group had received death threats from syndicate members.
"There are about 20 syndicate members all in all; whereas there are about 120,000 members in the police service," the spokesman said. "We will therefore not be intimidated by them."
Avishar allegedly had contacts with a reputed mob leader in Israel, Yossi Harari, who is reported to have been convicted in Israel of four criminal charges.
Avishar and his former wife, Johannesburg socialite Hazel Crane, were friends of Winnie Madikizela-Mandela, who has remained a prominent and influential politician since her divorce from former President Nelson Mandela a few years ago.
Crane is reported to have fled the country because she believed her life was in danger from members of the syndicate. Before fleeing, she reported receiving death threats from the group.
Police suspect that Avishar was murdered by another member of the syndicate after an apparent double-cross in a diamond deal.
Police have linked an additional two murders to the syndicate, and they suspect a third.
In the two incidents linked to the group, the victims' heads had been covered with a shawl.
Motti Raz, who came to South Africa in 1996, apparently launched the "Israeli mafia." He was later killed and his body found, also in a shallow grave, near Johannesburg.
The syndicate has been implicated in various crimes, including illegal diamond dealing, drug trafficking, protection payments and illegal firearms.
The syndicate is said to operate primarily in the three largest cities in South Africa - Johannesburg, Cape Town and Durban - where Jews have been the prime targets of the group.
The police say that so far four syndicate members have been killed, all by their own people.
"They are powerful, but they are killing their own people because they are too greedy," the police spokesman said.
One suspected member of the syndicate, Camilllo Zavatani, has appeared in court on charges of illegal possession of firearms and ammunition.
Police have named two other suspected members, Lior Saadt and Amir Moilla, as murder suspects and are on the run.
Posted 05 May 2003 - 10:59 PM
Police crack Colombian crime scam
By Heidi J. Gleit
TEL AVIV (May 29) - A gang of Israelis is suspected of counterfeiting millions of dollars and planning to sell weapons to Colombian terrorists, according to Tel Aviv police, who have been investigating the gang for the past year with the assistance of the US Secret Service and the Colombian DSA.
Israeli and Colombian police arrested several gang members, before they took possession of the weapons which they had bought in Europe and intended to smuggle to Colombia, according to police sources, who would not specify the type or quantity of weapons involved.
The gang also counterfeited millions of dollars in Colombia and distributed them throughout Asia, North and South America, and Israel, they said.
A non-Israeli member of the gang was murdered recently in Colombia. Police are investigating whether the murder was the result of a dispute within the gang.
Tel Aviv Magistrate's Court yesterday remanded David Birenboim, 52, of Tel Aviv, and Yaron Cohen, 45, of Nahariya, until next Monday on suspicion that they are involved. Police found forged dollars and incriminating documents when they searched Birenboim's and Cohen's homes after arresting them on Friday.
Colombian police have arrested three Israelis from Tel Aviv who have been living in Colombia for the past few years. Amos Shimoni, 21, who is suspected of being a courier for the gang, was caught with $100,000 in counterfeit money. The role of the other suspects - Yitzhak Richter, 55, and Ofer Zismanovich, 46 - is unclear.
More arrests are expected both here and abroad.
Posted 06 May 2003 - 12:22 AM
About this man, he had a number stenciled on his forearm. But, when you read the trial of the Commandant of Auswitz, he argued that they never received a prisoner without paperwork and documentation and that they always tatooed their prisoners with these numbers. The Prosecuting attorney said they never tattooed anyone and instead killed everyone and kept no paperwork, almost 4 million. In other words, the defendent was supposed to prove that he was innocent rather than the prosecution proving that the defendent was guilty. If you did not know that the Jews from these camps numbered into the thousands, when they held their annual get togethers, you could be fooled. It is just another situation where millions are claimed but there is actually no basis for the number. Like the charge of the prosecutgion, the number has no substance. The long dead commandant said he never took a prisoner without paperwork and he never killed a prisoner, let alone used gas.
Posted 06 May 2003 - 01:01 AM
Nevetheless the information gives me the same problem. Getting the truth now, and to determine the degree of certainty one puts on such information is difficult. I oten tend to rely on the character of the person, then get as many stories as I can and see if they point in the same direction, which increases ones certainty.
Posted 06 May 2003 - 02:36 AM
( in Maxims of George Washington by A. A. Appleton & Co.)
"They (the Jews) work more effectively against us, than the enemy's armies. They are a hundred times more dangerous to our liberties and the great cause we are engaged in... It is much to be lamented that each state, long ago, has not hunted them down as pest to society and the greatest enemies we have to the happiness of America."
(This prophecy, by Benjamin Franklin, was made in a "CHIT CHAT AROUND THE TABLE DURING INTERMISSION", at the Philadelphia Constitutional Convention of 1787. This statement was recorded in the dairy of Charles Cotesworth Pinckney, a delegate from South Carolina.)
"I fully agree with General Washington, that we must protect this young nation from an insidious influence and impenetration. The menace, gentlemen, is the Jews.
In whatever country Jews have settled in any great number, they have lowered its moral tone; depreciated its commercial integrity; have segregated themselves and have not been assimilated; have sneered at and tried to undermine the Christian religion upon which that nation is founded, by objecting to its restrictions; have built up a state within the state; and when opposed have tried to strangle that country to death financially, as in the case of Spain and Portugal.
For over 1,700 years, the Jews have been bewailing their sad fate in that they have been exiled from their homeland, as they call Palestine. But gentlemen, did the world give it to them in fee simple, they would at once find some reason for not returning. Why? Because they are vampires, and vampires do not live on vampires. They cannot live only among themselves. They must subsist on Christians and other people not of their race.
If you do not exclude them from these United States, in their Constitution, in less than 200 years they will have swarmed here in such great numbers that they will dominate and devour the land and change our form of government, for which we Americans have shed our blood, given our lives our substance and jeopardized our liberty.
If you do not exclude them, in less than 200 years our descendants will be working in the fields to furnish them substance, while they will be in the counting houses rubbing their hands. I warn you, gentlemen, if you do not exclude Jews for all time, your children will curse you in your graves.
Jews, gentlemen, are Asiatics, let them be born where they will nor how many generations they are away from Asia, they will never be otherwise. Their ideas do not conform to an American's, and will not even thou they live among us ten generations. A leopard cannot change its spots. Jews are Asiatics, are a menace to this country if permitted entrance, and should be excluded by this Constitutional Convention."
( 17th century Dutch governor in America.)
"The Jews who have arrived would nearly all like to remain here, but learning that they (with their customary usury and deceitful trading with the Christians) were very repugnant to the inferior magistrates, as also to the people having the most affection for you; the Deaconry also fearing that owing to their present indigence they might become a charge in the coming winter, we have, for the benefit of this weak newly developing place and land in general, deemed it useful to require them in a friendly way to depart; praying also most seriously in this connection, for ourselves also for the general community of your worships, that the deceitful race - such hateful enemies and blasphemers of the name of Christ - not be allowed further to infect and trouble this new colony."
(Letter to the Amsterdam Chamber of the Dutch West India Company, from New Amsterdam, September 22, 1654.)
(18th century American statesman)
"Dispersed as the Jews are, they still form one nation, foreign to the land they live in."
Thomas Jefferson (D. Boorstin, THE AMERICANS)
"Those who labor in the earth are the Chosen People of God, if ever he had a chosen people."
Thomas Jefferson (NOTES ON VIRGINIA)
Looks like the founding fathers of The Confederation were also "anti-semites". Weren't they ???
Posted 06 May 2003 - 11:54 PM
One isn't supposed to say this, but many people believe that Israel now holds the White House, the Senate, and much of the American media in its hands. This is what is known as an anti-Semitic conspiracy theory.
The odd thing is that it is held by many Israelis. In an essay reprinted in the May 27  issue of the New York Times Ari Shavit, an Israeli columnist, reflected sorrowfully on the wanton Israeli killing of more than a hundred Lebanese civilians in April. "We killed them out of a certain naive hubris. Believing with absolute certitude that now, with the White House, the Senate, and much of the American media in our hands, the lives of others do not count as much as our own ..."
In a single phrase - "in our hands" - Mr. Shavit has lit up the American political landscape like a flash of lightning.
Notice that Mr. Shavit assumes as an obvious fact what we Americans can say publicly only at our own risk. It's surprising, and refreshing, to find such candor in an American newspaper (though his essay was reprinted from the Israeli paper Haaretz).
The prescribed cant on the subject holds that Israel is a "reliable ally" of the United States, despite Israel's long record of double-dealing against this country, ranging from the killing of American sailors to constant espionage and technology theft. The word "ally" implies that the relationship exists because it's in the interests of this country, though Israel's lobby is clearly devoted to the interests of Israel itself, and it's childish to suggest otherwise.
You expect that from the Israeli lobby; lobbies are lobbies, after all. But it's unnerving that the White House, the Senate, and much of the American media should be "in our hands," as Mr. Shavit puts it. Bill Clinton, a lover of peace since his college days, raised no protest when the Israelis drove 400,000 innocent Lebanese out of their homes this year in "retaliation" for rockets launched into Israel (wounding one Israeli) by a faction over whom those 400,000 had no control.
Congress of course, was supine as usual at this latest extravagance of Israeli "defense." Congress too is "in our hands."
A recent article in the Washington Post likened the Israel lobby's power to that of the gun and tobacco lobbies. But there is one enormous difference. Newspapers like the Post aren't afraid to criticize the gun and tobacco lobbies. They will say forthrightly that those lobbies seek goals that are dangerous for this country. They don't dare say as much of the Israel lobby.
But much of the press and electronic media are "in our hands" in a more active sense: they supply misleading pro-Israel propaganda in the guise of news and commentary, constantly praising Israeli democracy and ignoring Israel's mistreatment of its non-Jewish minorities - mistreatment which, if any government inflicted it on a Jewish minority, would earn it the fierce opprobrium of our media.
No decent American would think of reducing American Jews to the status of Palestinians in Israel. The idea is almost absurd. Yet Americans are taxed to subsidize the oppression of Palestinians, on the flimsy pretext that they are helping an "ally" in America's own selfinterest, as if it were in our interest to be hated and despised by thc whole Muslim world.
All this is interesting less for what. it tells us about Israel than for what it tells us about America. Frank discussion of Israel is permitted in Israel, as Mr. Shavit's article illustrates. It's rarely permitted here. Charges of anti-Semitism and a quiet but very effective boycott will be the reward of any journalist who calls attention to his own government's - and his own profession's - servitude to Israeli interests.
Very few in America are doing anything to change that sorry state of affairs. Mr. Shavit wrote his article in the desperate hope of turning back his countrymen and his government from a morally and politically perilous course. At least he can hope. It's harder for us, when our own government isn't in our hands.
Posted 07 May 2003 - 12:32 AM
Israel has been torn by a dispute over the definition of a Jew - a grave problem for a government dedicated to Jewry The Orthodox rabbinate, which prevails in Israel, refuses to accept converts to Reform and Conservative Judaism as authentic Jews. For the Orthodox, claiming to be a Jew isn't enough; that way chaos lies. Only those converted according to strict Orthodox procedures, including circumcision, are eligible for Israeli citizenship. Many non-Orthodox Jews find this outrageous.
Meanwhile, the Union of Orthodox Rabbis of the United States and Canada has issued a statement rejecting Reform and Conservative Judaism as not Judaism at all, but as "an alien religion." This has only added to the fury of other Jews.
Orthodox Judaism, with its hundreds of severe and minute rules, is a little like a rhinoceros: you may not think it's a pretty house pet, but it's built to last. It grossly offends all modern notions of universalism, equality, civil rights, sexual freedom, and simple human conviviality. It has offended the morals and manners of earlier civilizations, which have generally accused the Jews of misanthropy and worse. But the old rhino has never much cared what outsiders think of it. And it has kept Jewry in continuous existence for more than three millennia, while whole civilizations have come and gone.
Without Orthodox Judaism, there would be no Jews today. Even to call it "Orthodox" is misleading. For most of history, it was the only form of Judaism. Reform and Conservative Judaism date from the nineteenth century, and both reflect the desire of many Jews to define themselves on terms more compatible with the modern world. To the Orthodox, these adaptations mean not only fatal compromise but disobedience to divine law.
At the least, the staying power of these Westernized forms of Judaism seems highly questionable. Jewry has survived thanks precisely to the exclusive nature of Judaism - its refusal of intermarriage, close association, and easy fellowship with gentiles. It regards assimilation, so tempting to other Jews, with utter horror. And it can point to the high rates of defection and intermarriage among modern Jews as justification for its stern self-segregation.
Considered backward in every age, Torah Judaism has survived every age, every successive form of modernity. That in itself is an awesome fact that commands, if not veneration, at least respect.
C. S. Lewis observed that liberal Christianity was always a way out of orthodox Christianity, never a way in. The cannibal doesn't convert to Unitarianism and progress to High Church Anglicanism; he converts to some dogmatic, evangelical version of the faith, or he doesn't convert. The whole idea of Unitarianism is to strip Christianity down to an acceptably undemanding form that may provide comfort for those who are weary of the rigors of a sterner faith, but it doesn't inspire the heathen to sign up for active duty. There are Christians today only because there were once martyrs willing to die for the very things the liberal Christian rejects.
In the same way, it seems highly doubtful that if the Jews of the ancient or medieval world had been Reform Jews, there would be any Jews today. I don't mean to pound the Reform Jews; but it appears to me that they are only one version of the modern Jewish identity crisis.
Posted 07 May 2003 - 01:38 AM
Despite ferocious persecution, the children of Abraham have prospered amazingly in the modern world. We are in 'the middle of a sort of Jewish Renaissance, a burst of intelligence and genius rarely equaled. In my own scholarly pursuits, for example, I've never studied a field in which some of the best work wasn't done by Jews. And this is only one facet of their talent. In proportion to their numbers, Jews are the most successful and powerful group in the United States today They have both raw power, political and economic, and enormous intellectual influence, shaping America's self-understanding but doing much to de-Christianize American public life; the Jewish revival has its darker and troubled side. Jews have also made their contributions to crime, political subversion, and cultural perversity. The Jews have given the modern world some of its most brilliant minds, but also some of its most notable intellectual charlatans: for every Einstein there has been a Marx or a Freud.
The remarkable fact is that the Jewish Renaissance has occurred, for better and worse, largely among the non-Orthodox. It may actually be inseparable from the Jewish identity crisis of modernity The Jews who have left Judaism have not, by and large, left Jewry, even when they have married gentiles. And they are preoccupied with finding new ways of defining what it means to be "Jewish," while tacitly renouncing Orthodox Judaism itself. Jews in the media, for example, rarely call attention to their Orthodox brethren.
The Jewish quest for identity has generated many ideologies. At first these tended to be universalist political creeds: liberalism, socialism, Communism. But these abstract creeds have more recently been displaced by the interlocked particularist causes of Zionism and anti-anti-Semitism. Supporting Israel and opposing anti-Semitism have now become ways of being a "good Jew" without observing the Mosaic law. Keeping kosher has been superseded by supporting Israel. Even many of the Orthodox have become fanatically attached to Israel, though Zionism is a modern political ideology, conceived on the model of European nationalism. Israel began its existence as a secular socialist democracy, a homeland for the Jews and a refuge from anti-Semitism, though opposed as sacrilegious by the most strictly Orthodox (some of whom remain adamant).
Posted 07 May 2003 - 02:02 AM
The Jews had the peculiar habit of recording and treasuring the divine rebukes, a practice at thc opposite pole from the usual chauvinism o: the human race and from the chauvinism of Zionist "Jewishness." Chauvinism always glorifies, justifies, and excuses one's own nation, while blaming others for its troubles. The all-purpose word "anti-Semitism" is used to explain all frictions between Jews and gentiles; in the moral universe of secular Jewishness there is no such fault, or word, as "anti-gentilism," because the ideology itself is so thoroughly anti-gentile in its premises.
This is why so many Jewish apologists for Israel - even clever men like William Safire, Martin Peretz, and Charles Krauthammer - can never admit that the Palestinians or even American critics of Israel have a point. They never seem to feel it may appear morally odd that the Israelis should always be in the right, and are never embarrassed to take the Zionist party line in every dispute.
According to the ideology, the survival of the Jewish people is inseparable from Israel and its "right to exist. "Yet it wasn't Zionism that preserved the Jews for thousands of years; it was Judaism. And Israel itself hasn't preserved the Jews for the last half-century; on the contrary, Israel's existence bas been secured by Diaspora Jewry especially the Jewish "lobby' in the United States. The Zionist pioneers envisioned a homeland where Jews could be "normal," free from the marginal, precarious, and "parasitic" existence they were forced to live in other nations. But Jews now live "normal" lives in the Western countries where they have no special status, while Israel is heavily dependent on outside help. Israelis regard it as a moral failing for other Jews to continue living in Diaspora instead of migrating to Israel. Yet the Israelis themselves rely on those Jews for their sustenance.
Posted 07 May 2003 - 02:03 AM
Nothing could better illustrate the moral corrosiveness, not of Judaism, but of liberalism. Judaism never felt vexed by the absence of anti-Semitism. The source of its strength was internal, not the hostility of its neighbors. A secular Jew like Dershowitz can't give a compelling reason why Jews should survive as a distinct group. The question doesn't present itself when danger looms; you fight for survival first and philosophize later. Secular Jewishness is so empty because it has defined itself in terms of enemies who have ceased to exist. That's why it has to keep redefining "anti-Semitism" to include even people who insist that they are not anti-Semitic (Pat Buchanan, Pat Robertson, the Christian Right).
When no avowed and visible enemy exists, covert and invisible enmity has to he posited. In a strange counterpoint to Torah Judaism, which claims to define who is a Jew, secular Jewish groups like the Anti-Defamation League now claim the privilege of deciding who is an anti-Semite. A gentile's denial that he's an anti-Semite counts for little with this secular rabbinate, which may rule that he's an anti-Semite anyway It is sufficient grounds for condemnation if he opposes the claims of Zionism or speaks critically of the American Jewish lobby
This is why I sometimes quip that an "anti-Semite" is no longer a man who hates Jews, but a man who is hated by Jews.
Torah Judaism has no need of such malevolent quibbling, because it doesn't need anti-Semitism to create Jewish "identity" But Torah Judaism is pro-foundly embarrassing to secular Jewishness, which does its best to marginalize the Orthodox Jew along with the anti-Semite. Not the least curious fact in this whole situation is that the secular Jewish ideology not only exaggerates the significance of the anti-Semite, but minimizes the significance of 'the Orthodox Jew. Which one does it really regard as the greater threat to its version of "Jewishness"?
Posted 07 May 2003 - 11:16 PM
"The fact is that the Jews were known only as destroyers in ancient history, not creators. They have developed no science, have produced no art, have built no great cities, and alone have no talent for the finer things of civilized life. The Jews claim to be the torchbearers of civilization, but thorough their parasitic habits have deteriorated or destroyed every nation in which they have existed in large numbers." (Charles A. Weisman, Who is Esau-Edom?, p. 28).
Posted 07 May 2003 - 11:46 PM
"It is the Jews who originated biblical exegesis (a critical analysis of the Bible), just as they were the first to criticize the forms and doctrines of Christianity...Truly has Darmesteter written: 'The Jew was the apostle of unbelief, and every revolt of mind originated with him.'" (Bernard Lazare, Antisemitism: It's History and Causes, London: Britons Publishing Co., 1967, pp. 149-151).
Posted 08 May 2003 - 12:24 AM
"The Jews are more subject to diseases of the nervous system than the other races and peoples among which they dwell. Hysteria and neurasthenia appear to be most frequent. Some physicians of large experience among the Jews have even gone so far as to state that most of them are neurasthenic and hysterical." (The Jewish Encyclopedia, Vol. IX, (1905), p. 225).
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